Here's a Topic. Discuss Amongst Yourselves:
I'm a little verklempt.I have a topic for you all today and I'd love to hear you weigh in on it. This is the perfect crowd for this question too. Among my vast readership there are a number of ministers, elders, deacons, elder's wives, elder's sons and daughters, deacon's wives, deacon's sons and daughters, and the myriad extended family and friends of ministers, elders, and deacons. Of course, this makes it sound like there are a huge number of you but we all know that truthfully it's just a handful and most of you fall into many of the above categories. For instance, I'm using Brady as a minister AND an elder's son, and throwing in minister's brother-in-law, and friend to many others. In other words, when I think of my readership, Brady counts for, like, 12.
Here's the question: How old should one be to be considered for the eldership?
Here are some things I know and you don't have to address. Everybody is different. Maturity and spiritual wisdom are not directly connected to physical age. The scriptures are not pointed on the subject of age, but do make reference to a wife and children (and those two discussions are for another time).
But surely you would be surprised, to say the least, to have a 25-year-old submitted for approval as an elder. So, somewhere, in the back of our minds, there probably is an age requirement. I'm wondering what yours is.
A couple of personal points and then the floor is yours. First of all, I have very liberal views on this position. I'm not convinced that the church is required to use the Pauline guidelines to appoint elders any more than I am convinced that we should be using any of Paul's desires for the church 2000 years ago to impact how we do things today. In other words, if your church is selecting elders according to the instructions Paul laid down, then none of them had better have long hair.
This may lead you to ask me if I think that an elder must be male. I do not. But take me to task for that later. Today's topic is age, not gender.
Secondly, I'm aware that this all sounds like I'm wondering if it's time for me to step up. It has very little to do with that. It's simply a discussion that has been cropping up the past few weeks and I'm looking for other perspectives. I truly want to know what you think. So have at it.
posted by Thurman8er @ 9:49 AM
6 Comments:
Steve-
To make things interesting, can we wager on the over/under for the average age that is suggested before, say noon tomorrow?
I'm tempted to avoid the answer and just say that you're looking for someone who is (1) respected and (2) wise in the ways of the cross and (3) seems to be at least SOME distance down the road of spiritual formation. But that doesn't quantify, so...
In my faith community, I would say it ought to be around 35. In reality, its probably 45 or 50. Your faith community's mileage may vary.
Also - a good side discussion some day might be this: how many Gen-X elders do you know? (anybody at low 40s and younger). There is data that boomers in the business world are reluctant to turn over the reigns of authority to X-ers. Think that will happen in the church?
As has already been mentioned, bishops should already be pastoring before they are ever named. That doesn't mean that they shouldn't be named. Congregational recognition is important, if not essential, for a man to be an elder.
Secondly, I see no reason not to follow the guidelines that Paul wrote to both Timothy and Titus. He had much more experience in naming elders than I've ever had. I'm willing to be shepherded by that kind of person he describes. And I'm willing to submit to Paul's recommendations on those points. I think to do otherwise would be a grave error.
About age, I'm only 47 now, and realize how much farther I have to grow as a Christian. Age often brings meekness, a capacity to listen, an experience of life with Jesus (and life in general) that young men cannot have. I see my sin far more clearly than ever. Young men may be wise, but often are divisive and impatient with us struggling stragglers.
Of course, I know that older people can become hard of heart, hard of hearing and short on experience. That's a given. But those folks should not become elders, or should be asked to stop carrying that title.
I know this is not my blog, but let me dare add: Bishops are not opinion leaders. They teach people how to live in Christ, they exhort and encourage, correct even, but they should not build up their faction or use their sway to "move the church" "forward". They are not there to transform the church into the image they have for it but to serve the people they have been called to serve. Nudge them, yes. Chasten them even. But leaving people behind… Shepherds are not called to do that.
Thanks for listening.
I think we have made the "office" of an elder just that--and office. They have become decision makers and not shepherds. Our mistunderstanding has led to al kinds of heresy.
We have tried to fit people into a mold that no one can completly fill. We take "qualifications" and attempt to find men with those perfectly in place at the time we find them. We then expect them to stay perfect while running everything in the church except what God calls them to do.
What is the perfect age for that? In the good old southern way of saying it, "There ain't one!"
Now as for shepherds who lead by example, serving, and many other shepherding terms, I think that starts naturally. I think there are lots of "elders" who are not recognized by "the church" who naturally lead others to Jesus. We recognize them by the sheep they have following them.
Lynn Anderson says something very wise about shepherding. He says that if you think your a leader and no one is following you, you are just taking a stroll. How true!
probably doesn't help your age issue very much, but it sure feels good saying all that!
As an, oops, I almost used the “e-word” to the consternation of my good friend, Randy.
Let’s digress one moment – I heard this statement from an elderly (no pun intended) gentleman who I sat next to at breakfast one day at the Pepperdine Bible Lectures. He had backgrounds in our fellowship and the Christian Church. I shared with him how at our church, we were trying to change the “Authoritarian over the Ministers” operational paradigm at our church. He said in the Christian Church they have a saying with respect to the vision of a local church, “Staff Driven / Elder Protected.” Perhaps if “we” were to let go of the current "Biblical" model we have that I think in some ways, flies in the face of Paul telling the young minister Timothy, to appoint elders at the local church, we would have less problems in this area.
“Any-who,” I hesitate to come up with a minimum age since I’m such a young (you know what Randy) at age 47. So, I’ll join the “I can't quote a specific minimum age” camp. I do believe there are certain experiences one should have that would help him (or “her” Steve) to be more effective shepherd for a church such as raising kids, having a good “rep” in the “hood,” and of course, evidence of the individual already shepherding within the Body.
O.K. Steve – you want a number. How about 714? No silly, get back on subject. O.K., I think it would be rare to find an individual with the above qualities younger than say, 30? I’m not saying it couldn’t happen but I’ll throw a 30 into the mix.
lnbIn Melbourne we sort of take a bassakwards approach. We don't even considere age. We look for the people who are doing the shepherding and consider asking them to serve as shepherds. We also ask the church to tell us who they talk to when they have a problem of any kind. This has led us to some good shepherds. Youngest elder we've had was 35.
Peace.
Hi, my name is Tonya. I'm not really anonymous. I'm just not a blogger or have a webpage. I happened upon this discussion by way of a family webpage. I noticed that the discussion never mentioned the one thing that always is in my mind regarding the age of an elder. As an Elder's daughter, I had our family life change drastically when my father first became an elder when I was in the 6th grade. Our family handled it OK, but I always feel for the family of a man called to serve in this way. I would never suggest it to a man whose children are so young. I would want them to be at least in high school or otherwise showing enough maturity to handle having a parent absent so much in service in the church. This is completely apart from the injunction that he have believing children.
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